How much to get into JO/travel volleyball matches?
- Thread starter Yappi
- Start date
ElderMackStud
Active member
For the weekend or each day? Daily passes are usually around $10-$12 plus around $30 to park
BASESWIMPARENT
Well-known member
Your thoughts are correct 8 am starts for high school age girls are crazy. You are definitely not getting the best out of them at that time.
Auggie
Well-known member
8:00 AM is too early but I have been in some convo centers at 8:00 PM trying to figure out how to get the kids to diner and in bed to start it all over again the next morning. I guess this biggest challenge with volleyball is that it is not a timed sport and some courts have evenly matched up teams with many long 3 set matches while others are mostly 2 set sweeps that are done quickly; also the staff usually doesn't want to be working late on a weekend evening.
Yappi
Go Buckeyes
I noticed that during the middle school volleyball and basketball seasons. Basketball was fairly constant. Volleyball varied widely the starting times of the next age group. It definitely added to the crowd size pre-Covid when the first match went three sets.
Yappi
Go Buckeyes
Since this seems to be the right thread to talk about JO, has anyone seen boys playing in girls volleyball? I'm not talking about the controversy of transgenders becoming girls and playing. Just simply regular boys dressing in shorts playing on girls teams.
I'm very new to volleyball but saw a team two weeks ago with two boys playing with a team. Is this normal and typically allowed?
I'm very new to volleyball but saw a team two weeks ago with two boys playing with a team. Is this normal and typically allowed?
ElderMackStud
Active member
Did this tournament have mostly Regional or National teams? I am on my second "stint" with my youngest daughter now involved and I have never seen that
Auggie
Well-known member
Never saw this at the American or National level. The bigger clubs have boys programs so I would be surprised to see any mixed teams these days.
What I do see sometimes are American teams that are basically National Teams in quality of play competing at the American level. From what I understand there are a couple factors for these teams:
- Cost: National level play usually requires air travel and multiple hotel night stays, those things are not cheap. Also many of these teams have a 2nd coach and PT as part of the plan; those things cost extra $s.
- Time Commitment: Most national programs have at a minimum 4 days practice and the tournaments require Friday-Monday commitments when including travel so that means missing school.
- Team Commitment: Most National teams do not allow a player to miss more than a couple practices let alone a single Qualifier Set. This basically cuts out any girl that would like to do another activity from December through July.
TriangleMan
Hates Particle Man
I saw that a few years ago, think a club from Kidron had some boys on either a 12R or 13R team. IIRC there were stipulations like 1) no more than (2) boys per team and 2) boys were not eligible to play in the front row.
Yappi
Go Buckeyes
As being a first timer to JO Volleyball, I'm just posting my observations and not trying to complain about JO Volleyball because my experiences are extremely limited.
One thing that I have seen so far is very little communication about schedules. We play this Saturday 2nd, 3rd, and 5th. Assuming one hour for each start time. This schedule came out today. I've only seen one bracket posted at a tournament. The rest have come through the coach's assistant. With all the Covid restrictions, it would be nice to be able to plan on Sunday bracket times. Will they be at 8AM or 4PM or somewhere in between? This can be the difference in who attends on these precious passes that are limited at each tournament.
My experience comes mostly from baseball/softball where schedules are much more widely posted.
One thing that I have seen so far is very little communication about schedules. We play this Saturday 2nd, 3rd, and 5th. Assuming one hour for each start time. This schedule came out today. I've only seen one bracket posted at a tournament. The rest have come through the coach's assistant. With all the Covid restrictions, it would be nice to be able to plan on Sunday bracket times. Will they be at 8AM or 4PM or somewhere in between? This can be the difference in who attends on these precious passes that are limited at each tournament.
My experience comes mostly from baseball/softball where schedules are much more widely posted.
TriangleMan
Hates Particle Man
What types of tournaments are you attending and who is hosting these? OVR two-day Regional or American Challenges, JVA weekend events pulling from multiple states?
First day pool play is always the same, you just guess at the actual start times of matches 2-6.
Auggie
Well-known member
Pool play schedule is cast in stone by seed;
1 v 3
2 v 4
1 v 4
2 v 3
3 v 4
1 v 2
Now times depends on how long the matches are. Overall #1 seed pools tend to go quickly because not only do they have the best team on paper but they also usually involve the lowest seeded team at 4 so there are a lot of blow outs and 2 setters. On the other hand the middle rated pools have a lot of teams bunched together so there are a lot of 3 setters and close matches.
Because of the NCAA hoops tourney in Indy the older MEQ ages were in Louisville this weekend, how did the Ohio clubs do? Not a good showing on the 17s but the 18s got a couple bids out of MEQ.
1 v 3
2 v 4
1 v 4
2 v 3
3 v 4
1 v 2
Now times depends on how long the matches are. Overall #1 seed pools tend to go quickly because not only do they have the best team on paper but they also usually involve the lowest seeded team at 4 so there are a lot of blow outs and 2 setters. On the other hand the middle rated pools have a lot of teams bunched together so there are a lot of 3 setters and close matches.
Because of the NCAA hoops tourney in Indy the older MEQ ages were in Louisville this weekend, how did the Ohio clubs do? Not a good showing on the 17s but the 18s got a couple bids out of MEQ.
Yappi
Go Buckeyes
So here is how this weekend went:
Saturday morning:
4 pools of 4 teams. Each team played the other three.
Saturday afternoon:
Reseed 16 teams into 4 pools. Top 8 were split equally into 2 pools. Bottom 8 were split equally into another 2 pools. First game of pool played for every team.
Sunday Morning:
Games 2 and 3 for each team of each pool were played.
Sunday afternoon:
Bracket play started with 4 brackets. Gold, silver, bronze, and copper.
I get that the scheduled times can be delayed or start early, it would just be nice to have an idea that this is the format for the tournament. We knew about the first pool games only. Nothing about the repool. Nothing about the brackets. Our last pool game ended at 11AM. First bracket game was at 3:30PM. Plenty of time to do something in between if necessary. Maybe they get alot of complaints when things don't run on time so they don't advertise "times" anymore but a general structure would be nice to have.
Overall, it is fun to watch and the games are quick. Better websites with results and brackets is the one suggestion I would give to those running tournaments.
Saturday morning:
4 pools of 4 teams. Each team played the other three.
Saturday afternoon:
Reseed 16 teams into 4 pools. Top 8 were split equally into 2 pools. Bottom 8 were split equally into another 2 pools. First game of pool played for every team.
Sunday Morning:
Games 2 and 3 for each team of each pool were played.
Sunday afternoon:
Bracket play started with 4 brackets. Gold, silver, bronze, and copper.
I get that the scheduled times can be delayed or start early, it would just be nice to have an idea that this is the format for the tournament. We knew about the first pool games only. Nothing about the repool. Nothing about the brackets. Our last pool game ended at 11AM. First bracket game was at 3:30PM. Plenty of time to do something in between if necessary. Maybe they get alot of complaints when things don't run on time so they don't advertise "times" anymore but a general structure would be nice to have.
Overall, it is fun to watch and the games are quick. Better websites with results and brackets is the one suggestion I would give to those running tournaments.
Auggie
Well-known member
So what your player competed in was probably a Challenge, those are 2 day affairs and are bigger events for this level of comp. The format is cast in stone but times widely vary depending on how close the matches are. Not knowing the club it should have been called out that it was a challenge and the format is available at the OVR web site:
https://www.ovr.org/juniors/tournament_packet/JTP_Tournament_Format_16RC.pdf
Now the bigger National Qualifying events use an app called AES that has results posted after the completion of each match so you know what is going on. These have a similar format with the re-pooling after the initial AM matches with ties decided by playing off to decide who get the higher seed. Nothing more tense than sitting in an empty convo center at 8:00 PM on a Saturday evening to see if your kid has a chance to play in the higher bracket.
Yappi
Go Buckeyes
Almost done with the volleyball season. One major critique I have is the lack of scheduling. I'm much more familiar with softball and almost every softball tournament we are able to map out the next day or two based on schedules and brackets. The families, players, and coaches are all in the loop at most tournaments.
In volleyball, it seems like it's a game show with what is behind door #2? The schedule said 3 games, 9am, 10am, Noon. Sounds good. Hope to do well and play through the bracket the next day. But there's more. Another three games are now scheduled for sometime after 2pm. Can't quite say for sure when they will start or who you will be playing but there will be more games. Or it might be one more game and two more on Sunday. Then they will bracket the games. But you have to wait until Sunday to see the bracket. It really was maddening at some of these tournaments.
It should be upfront and easy. Know how many pool games. If they re-pool, that should be known. And empty brackets should be available whenever they release the weekend's schedules. In the Gold bracket, play at 9am. Silver, expect a Noon start. It should be widely available.
In volleyball, it seems like it's a game show with what is behind door #2? The schedule said 3 games, 9am, 10am, Noon. Sounds good. Hope to do well and play through the bracket the next day. But there's more. Another three games are now scheduled for sometime after 2pm. Can't quite say for sure when they will start or who you will be playing but there will be more games. Or it might be one more game and two more on Sunday. Then they will bracket the games. But you have to wait until Sunday to see the bracket. It really was maddening at some of these tournaments.
It should be upfront and easy. Know how many pool games. If they re-pool, that should be known. And empty brackets should be available whenever they release the weekend's schedules. In the Gold bracket, play at 9am. Silver, expect a Noon start. It should be widely available.
If you were playing in an OVR event, you pretty much know you can not make plans for the day unless you feel your team will go out early. I feel like the OVR is about as structured as they can get. The girls know when they are playing, sitting, reffing. Most places post brackets or have them online so you can see when you play/ref/sit next. I have been in both the softball and volleyball world and feel the volleyball world is more organized. They have an efficient seeding system. Softball is unpredicatable with the weather. I remember watching my 9 year old play at 11pm in Zanesville due to weather delays and have to turn around and be back at 8am. Softball tournaments also do not have an efficient seeding system so what should have been a #1 and #2 could be in the same pool.
Having said that.....I love both sports...and parents just have to go with the flow!
Yappi
Go Buckeyes
Today is a good example. It's the OVR championships in Columbus. Three pools of three teams starting at 8am. The #1 teams from each pool go into a new pool. The #2s their own pool. And the #3s in their own pool. Play starts at 11:15am. Not sure if this is a bracket or pool. Not sure if any games after that either.
I'm sure someone who has been here before knows exactly what it means but a first timer is left with alot of questions. Not knowing if there are brackets at 11:15 is frustrating.
I'm sure someone who has been here before knows exactly what it means but a first timer is left with alot of questions. Not knowing if there are brackets at 11:15 is frustrating.
TriangleMan
Hates Particle Man
All the schedules for the day are on AES. The second pool is a round robin then the day is over. The Court Schedule in the link below confirms this.
AES Event Results
Yappi
Go Buckeyes
When I look at that, an example is 16 Copper. It has their first two games, then pools below. No bracket, no schedule. If it is just more pool games, why not list the time and opponents seed? Something like:
5:00pm seed 1 vs seed 2
6:00pm seed 2 vs seed 3
7:00pm seed 1 vs seed 3
Just something that would make it easier for newbies like me that like to plan out potential times for games.
5:00pm seed 1 vs seed 2
6:00pm seed 2 vs seed 3
7:00pm seed 1 vs seed 3
Just something that would make it easier for newbies like me that like to plan out potential times for games.
TriangleMan
Hates Particle Man
Check out the Pool Sheets for each session.
For the first session, Pool A, I can see when and where my team is playing and working. Down below in Future Matches, I can see where my team will play in the next pool depending on where it finishes in Pool A.
When I know where I finished in Pool A (1, 2, or 3), using the Pool Sheet for Copper Medal, Copper 2, or Copper 3 I can see when and where my team is playing and working in that pool.
TriangleMan
Hates Particle Man
And in a normal, non-COVID year:
- there would be 60+ courts in the convention center and the latest matches would be done by around 7 PM. Having two waves on a Sunday, where we know the last match 'scheduled' for 8:15 could be pushed back to around 9, makes for a late drive home for most.
- there would be computers available on-site for you to track your team's upcoming schedule. I assume those are not used this year due to high-contact surfaces.
Auggie
Well-known member
I never had the problems Yappi has been harping on all season long, maybe it is Covid related? Maybe it is the coach or club not communicating the schedule properly? Again comparing it other sports is tricky as there is no clock and matches can have a variety of time needed to complete so outside of the 1st matches of the day start times can be all over the place. I also remember tourney softball uses a time limit for games to help with keeping on schedule, is this still the case? No way would JO volleyball ever do this as it takes away the integrity of the results.
Yappi
Go Buckeyes
I'm guessing that has been one of the biggest problems. As a first timer, we were disappointed. I had other family that played in the past 10 years that said repeatedly, that's not the way it was when we were going to games. Seems every change was for the worse in her opinion.
The schedule that @TriangleMan posted above is exactly what I was hoping for. It seems that is the way it should be but the schedule was always empty until the first pool play was completed. Some tournaments, there was an hour or two delay between pools, others started right at the conclusion of the first set of pools.
The best I saw was a tournament in Uniontown that had the pools and brackets posted at the door at the start of the tournament. The tournament in Akron was the most difficult to understand. They posted the first set of pools, ending midday. Expected to go home after that. But we were wrong. They set up a second set of pools and started around 2 hours later and played one game. The next two games were Sunday morning. After those pools were completed, they then put out a bracket. That was a long couple of days. If going in we had any clue that was how it was going to be, it would have been great. Not knowing and sitting around asking other parents if they knew what was going on with a bunch of shoulder shrugs made it a very long weekend.